Question about P3's and Celerons.... And RAM.... And fsb... Oh! And Videocards

[Max Power]

Okay, my celeron is 100 fsb... and I have pc100 RAM. Does that mean that PC133 RAM won't work with my CPU? Or does the fsb of the cpu have nothing to do with the mhz of the RAM? And... My mobo is a P3/Celeron bored, I don't want to get a new mobo till next year (around doom3). So I was wondering.... IS the fastest Celeron (1.3 Ghz I think), better then the fastest P3. Actully.... What is the fastest P3? Cause I wanna upgrade to PC133 RAM (the best my mobo can use) and the fastest/best CPU my mobo can handle. And what is the fastest videocard that the fastest P3/celeron can handle. Thanks, and sorry for the long post... and all the questions.

[Joe]

ECK! ... OK i have already answered these questions for you on ICQ .. but what the hell . i will answer them one more time<BR><BR><b><i>"Okay, my celeron is 100 fsb... and I have pc100 RAM. Does that mean that PC133 RAM won't work with my CPU?"</i></b><BR>No it does not ... PC133 will still run with your CPU ... it will just run at 100FSB .... therefore giving you no performance increase.<BR><BR><b><i>"Or does the fsb of the cpu have nothing to do with the mhz of the RAM? And... My mobo is a P3/Celeron bored"</i></b><BR>When you buy your CPU it should say on the site whether or not it is a 100mhz FSB CPU or a 133mhz FSB CPU. if it is (100) you will need atleast pc100 ram. if it is a (133CPU) you will need at least PC133 ram. <BR><BR><b><i>"I don't want to get a new mobo till next year (around doom3). So I was wondering.... IS the fastest Celeron (1.3 Ghz I think), better then the fastest P3. Actully.... What is the fastest P3?"</i></b><BR>First off, I have been telling you that you will need to get us the name of the motherboard you own ... this way we can tell you what it can support and what it can not. the 1.3ghz celeron is the fastest at the moment and i believe the pentium 3's went as high as 1.26ghz ... not to sure on that one though. but get us the name of your mobo so we can answer this question.<BR><BR><b><i>"Cause I wanna upgrade to PC133 RAM (the best my mobo can use) and the fastest/best CPU my mobo can handle. And what is the fastest videocard that the fastest P3/celeron can handle. Thanks, and sorry for the long post... and all the questions. </i></b><BR>again we will need to know what model and manufactor made your motherboard to answer then mobo questions. but as for the video card. do not spend more on your video card then you did on your cpu.. thats if you are going with intel lol ... 800mhz and lower a gf2 will be all you can utilize ... 1gig and above you should be able to utilize any of the new cards out. your best performance ratio would come from probaly a cpu that is 1.5ghz and up and a GF4 Ti4200 and up or equivelent<BR>

[Max Power]

Wow, that makes a lot of sense. Okay, I'll find my mobo make and model. I also wanna know if the Radeon Pro compairs to a geforce3 ti500 (and the Radeon 9000 compairs to a ti200). I can't find this information anywhere, and I don't really trust the specs of em... Or should I? I also wanna know what fsb the P3's have. Thanks, I know I'm starting to anoy you.

[Serialthriller]

i believe that the radeon 9000 pro 3dmark 2k1 tests came back at around 2800 points higher than the gf3ti200's...but correct me if i'm wrong someone, lol

[Juan]

The highest P3 I think there is, is the 1.4Ghz Tulutian. With the points I received on my Radeon 9000 Pro 64 I would compare it too a GForce 4 TI4200. I did post a little thing on the card in the forum under VideoCard so check it out if you want to and sometime soon when I get off this dialup crap I will post it on madonion. I can't right now because my connection sucks so bad that their server can never except it.

[Max Power]

cool, I have to get that. And I already know the fastest p3 is 1.26 ghz and its 133 fsb. Are the radeon 9000's different then the radeon 9000 pro's? I'm probably gonna get the pro but they dont list the 9000 (not pro) anywhere except reviews. Its not even on ati's site.<BR><BR>EDIT: I didn't know the P3 went up to 1.4 ghz. Arnt they all based on coppertone or whatever?

[Juan]

Here is some info on the P3 Tulutian:<BR><BR>The Pentium® III processor with 512K L2 cache offers affordable performance and reliability for entry- level 2-way servers. In addition, Pentium III processor-based platforms are the best choice for small form factor, e-Business server needs. They are ideal for applications that reside on low profile, high-density rack-mountable front-end Internet and intranet servers; as well as more traditional mail, file, print, and workgroup needs. The Pentium III processor's 2-way processing capability gives it scalability, flexibility and headroom in addition to providing the reliability, application base and tools to support both front-end Internet and small business critical applications. <BR><BR><BR>Excellent choice for low profile, rack mountable, front-end server requirements. <BR>Easy, affordable upgrade path provides a stable, manageable computing environment. <BR>Industry-proven dependability vital for e-Business success. <BR>Flexibility for both general purpose and growing e-Business infrastructures. <BR>The Pentium® III Processor with 512 K L2 Cache Offers<BR><BR><BR>Affordable price/performance for entry level servers <BR>Fast core speeds <BR>A broad range of enterprise operating systems, applications and development tools <BR>Based on the new 0.13-micron process core technology, 2-way Intel® Pentium® III processors feature 512 K Advanced Transfer Cache, high frequencies and a 133 MHz system bus. <BR>__________________________________________________ _________________________________<BR>If you are going to get a Tulutian Processcor make sure the board that you purchase can handle it!!!<BR><BR>

[Max Power]

So, are they a different type of P3 then the 1.26 ghz? Thats the fastest CPU my bored can support (and I don't want a new bored just yet), unless the 1.3 ghz celeron is faster (which I know is not true). This new P3 you talk about is not socket 370 like the other P3's, is it?

[Joe]

your wasting your money upgrading ancient stuff dude .. just save some cash and buy a complete new mobo, ram, cpu, and vid card

[Max Power]

Listen pimpy, I just want to be able to play all my current games (NWN, GTA3) with a higher res, and more stuff on. And with a 1 Ghz machine, 256 MB RAM, and a Geforce 3 lvl card (or even a Geforce2) you can run most current games at a decent res, and with most stuff turned on. I don't need a super fast PC like you guys, I'm just a kid, I can't afford all of this stuff, and my brain isn't big enough yet to understand the concept of 'saving money'. So just help me? Ill give you the name of my mobo soon. I emailed my dad (because im scaired to ask him) and he checks his email a few times everyday... And then I will ask you what CPU it supports or go to my mobos site and find out.<BR><BR>EDIT: It's an AOpen AX34-U. So what's the best stuff it supports?

[Juan]

Your board does support Tulutian but aopen.com didn't list how high it can go. Your board can also support PC150 with a bios update.

[Max Power]

PC150? I thought it only went up to PC133. I'm surprised that it supports Tulutian. Well, how high do the Tulutian P3's go to? What is the best 'band for your buck' upgrade? Oh, and I tried doing a bios upgrade (I have never done this before) I downloaded and unziped it. And there was a .bin file and a dos prompt file. I opened the dos one and it came up with something saying windows os does not support this, or something. What am I doing wrong?<BR><BR>EDIT: Did you see the <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.aopen.com/tech/report/cpuref/skt370U.htm">CPU chart</a> I think they say it's up to 1.4. But I'm probably reading it wrong.

[Juan]

There are different ways you can update your bios for your MB but never through a windows session that I have seen. Usually you can format a disk through dos. Go to Start, click Run, type command, then type format a: /s. This will create a startup disk but without all of the extra crap. Once this is created drag the .bin file to the disk. Now restart your computer and it should start flashing the bios or prompt you for it. You can try this but I would check your manual or go to aopen.com, lookup your mb, and click on manual. They should tell you the why it should be flashed. I have intel, via, and sis boards at home and they all flash a different way.

[Juan]

You are reading the chart right my friend! Where did you get your board? I have a few PIII's sitten around the house but all my 370 boards are FSB 100. I usually shop at googlegear but yours sounds like the one I am looking for.

[Juan]

I did find this for you:<BR><BR>1.Download this zipped file. <BR>2.Run shareware PKUNZIP (http://www.pkware.com/) which supports <BR> miscellaneous operation systems to extract the binary BIOS file and the<BR> flash utility. Or Winzip (http://www.winzip.com/) in Windows environment. <BR>3.Save "MX3WP106.EXE" and "MX3WP106.BIN" to a DOS floppy disk.<BR> Reboot your system with this disk without loading any memory handler <BR> (suh as EMM386) or device driver to get as much free space as possible (for tips to do this, click here). If you have an EPROM writer, simply take the .BIN file to program your BIOS.<BR> Note: Use this binary file only with its corresponding executable file (see 4.); avoid using this binary file with a generic 'AOFLASH' program, for this could lead to flash failure and hence boot problem. <BR>4.Execute A:>MX3WP106 and the program will do the rest of it. <BR>5.DO NOT turn off power during flashing process, until you are asked to!! <BR>6.Reboot system and press "DEL" to enter BIOS setup, load "BIOS SETUP <BR> DEFAULT", then SAVE and EXIT. Done! <BR>

[Juan]

Here is the link if you prefer that: <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="https://http://www.aopen.com/tech/download/mbbios/mbflash.htm">Text</a>

[Max Power]

So, what will upgrading my BIOS do? Will it fix bugs, or make games run faster?... Or add support for new stuff? What? And in your opionion what is the best 'bang for your buck' upgrade I can make?

[Juan]

The bios update can fix bugs and give you added support. For example: My board when I bought it could only handle up to the Athlon XP 1900+ and there was an issue with the AGP and 5th PCI trying to share IRQ addresses. With all the bios updates I have done I have support up to 2200+ right now, my Raid runs aliitle better and I have support for up to 2M array size, and I don't have the stupid IRQ issue anymore. A bios update can be a great thing for you but it can cause alot of problems if not done correctly. <BR><BR>If I was you I would update to the 1.4 Tulutian and get the PC150 since the board can handle it. With doing this there really isn't alot of stuff you need to update. You can go to the Socket 478 or Socket A but you will have to update your power supply, memory, processor, and maybe even your case to keep the system cool enough. With your board being an ATX your case should do just fine but if your PS isn't powerful enought you will need to update to atleast 350watts(That's what I would recommend). I hope this helps you out.

[Max Power]

Okay, Ill try to upgrade. Thanks.<BR><BR>But if the CPU is just 133 fsb why should I get pc150 ram? So how about a...<BR>Pentium3 1.4 Ghz Tulutian, 256 PC133 SDRAM (or should I get 512?), Windows XP, a 40 GB 7200 rpm Maxter (which will run at ATA/100 right? Which my bored supports), And a Radeon 9000 pro. How much will this cost (canadain)? I am planning on getting the RAM and the CPU first, then the Hardrive and Windows XP, and then the Videocard (and after that I will get a CD burner<img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0">. So is this all good stuff and such? Or should Ichange anything?

[Juan]

I would help you with the price but I don't know the US-Canadian conversion!!! It all sounds good to me..If I like Intels I would kiss ya!!! (Not really!!!!). For the memory part I would suggest 512MB. The reason being is that if you are going to get the 9000 Pro, give it a little bit more memory so you can see how beautiful those games will be. If you are tight on money though don't push yourself to broke...I've done that a few times and boy was my wife ticked at me! I am working on building a new system but I am waiting til AMD gets there 2800+ out. Update me on how your system is..I hope it rocks!

[Max Power]

Thanks, your a lot nicer then Pimpy up there. Okay heres the deal: According to Pricewatch I can get 512 MB PC133 and a P3 1.26 GHz 133fsb with 512kb cache for 330$ canadain. I will have enough cash for that by the end of december (not including xmas cash). That is my alowence if I don't buy anything (plus what I have right now) Which I am willing to do. I will then get the new hardrive and windows xp for xmas/right after xmas. And then the Radeon 9000 Pro in January/Febuary. Is that a good order? Oh! I could also get the new RAM right now, even though it would only run at 100 fsb, it would speed up my machine well I'm saving up the cash. So, does that all sound good? Thanks, this is my last question and like I said before your a lot nicer then Pimpy up there <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif" border="0"> <BR><BR>EDIT: I am also not planning on upgrading my BIOS until I get Windows XP, as one of the bugs that the new BIOS fixes is faster installing of Windows XP.<BR><BR>EDIT2: And according to pricewatch there is no 1.4 GHz P3. So the 1.2 Ghz one is fine right?

[Joe]

I was nice until you started asking the same question over and over and over on icq to me .... I don't know about you, but that tends to tick some people off when they here repeat questions. <BR><BR>and to tell you the truth it will be much cheaper to buy all new stuff then to upgrade that ancient stuff you are using.

[Juan]

I have seen a 1.4Ghz PIII but you have to look under <b>Tulutian</b> not PIII. If you are going to buy this around Xmas why not buy like a 2000+ AMD Athlon XP, 512 MB of PC2100 or PC2700, keep the Radeon 9000 Pro(Excellent choice for a budget), and a decent board like a MSI KT3 Ultra or a Soltek Socket A board. You'll be around the same Price Range and it will last a little longer. Plus it's not Intel!!!<BR>

[Joe]

Soyo Kt333 dragon lite is a nice board .. runs about 90bux at newegg and can support future peices of hardware. <BR><BR>epox 8k3a+ is nice also ... runs a but more .. but has more options

[Juan]

I like the Soyo board...nice!!!!!

[Max Power]

Well, I'm just a noob (compaired to you guys), and these are the only types of things I can install. Listen to this, I got a P1 166 32MB RAM ATI Rage card in 1998! Then in Xmas 2001 I got the ocmputer I have now (excluding the geforce2) and then got the geforce2 for my birthday. So... I don't know. Just, something. I just want to be able to play all my current games with most of the stuff on and a slightly higher res and such. I don't need a hold new PC till next year. I'm still a kid, I can't make all these upgrades just yet. Is the CPU I said I want a good one to upgrade too though. Or is the 1.4 Ghz one much more more expensive? And should I get the new RAM right now? And THIS IS NOT ANCHANT STUFF!!!! IT CAN RUN ALL NEW GAMES AT A RESpECTABLE FRAME RATE AND RES WIT HEVERYTHING TURNED ON! OKAY!????!!!

[Juan]

The price on googlegear.com is $219(US). If you want some info here you go..<a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.googlegear.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=80616">Text</a> I'm sorry man..I didn't realize. Your picks sound good and I would just go with those then my friend!

[Joe]

what you are not understanding is that the computer industry moves so fast that with in 6months of a card board , cpu or whatever it is already ancient .. yes it may play all current games. but it is still considered ancient stuff. If you are on a budget go amd ... if you wanna spend all the money in the world and have the same performance as a amd rig .. by all means go intel. <BR><BR>since you can play all games now .. i suggest you just save your money till next year or whenever you planned on doing a whole system upgrade .. and save it for that so you can get much faster hardware. waiting till then will also allow you to have some time to learn more about this stuff. If you would like I can point you to some sites that will help you learn this stuff. I know of a few sites that puts it in very easy to understand terms and will take you through step by step of building a system. <BR><BR>I dont want to sound like a a$$ here but I feel as if you need to do some more learning before you go and build a new system. I say this for two reasons. one - it will help you come up with a better decision on what is right for you and what you need to upgrade and what not<BR><BR>two - learning this stuff before actually buying it could possibly save you some fried computer parts. <BR><BR>I will be more then willing to help you on icq .. but you have to understand i am very busy and sometimes i do get a bit anoyed by things because i am busy.

[Max Power]

Ill think about it, ILl probably come back to this topic in a few days or something. I don't know, It seems like a good upgrade but quite expensive and such.

[Juan]

I think Pimpin Joe is right about learning a few more things too help you out. Check out tomshardware.com because they have a great piece on building PC's that would be just right for you. There are some spots it seems blunt but there is quite a few things that will help you out and make you more cautious on what you buy.

[Joe]

tomshardware is junk .. they are way to biased there and do the reviews just for the hardware and not the viewers <BR>

[Juan]

I understand that man but this is to help him out..not YOU!!

[Max Power]

Yeah, I have a site on building PC's already. I just wish someone could tell me exactly what to get with 350 (yes I'm stretching it alittle) I really just need to know what CPU and memory as I already know what else I'm getting... Or if someone can convince me to get a new mobo.

[Joe]

I will give you a cookie if you get a new mobo <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif" border="0"> .<BR><BR>convincing enough? ..... nah .. did'nt think so <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif" border="0"> <BR><BR><BR><img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif" border="0">

[Juan]

What kind of cookie?! I checked out some prices for ya Max. You can get a PIII 1.4 Ghz 512 cache, Radeon 9000 Pro, and 512 MB PC-133 for around $389. I know that is over what you want to spend. If you are going to build a computer within the next year I wouldn't spend that much because you can save that and get a rockin system. I would if I was you get a 1.3Ghz Celeron, Radeon 9000, and 256MB PC-133.

[Max Power]

Thats what I was gonna get awhile back, but then everyone said celerons suck soooo.... And when peeps say cookies do they mean the internet cookies. I hate those! Anyway, I really just want to get over a 1 GHZ so I can use radeon 9000 pro, so how about a PIII 1.2 Ghz 256 cache, Radeon 9000 Pro, and 256 MB PC-133. Then I can upgrade to a new mobo later. Can someone get me how much that will cost roughly, canadain, use the converter at <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/m3?u">http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/m3?u</a> please <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0">

[Joe]

ever thought of overclocking? you already have a 850mhz celeron. you can use the radeon 9000 with your celly.. I would suggest for now just upgrading your ram man .. and then just start saving your cash for a real nice ddr system.

[Juan]

At $389(US) it converted to $611(Canadian). You can overclock your Celeron but I am more into raising the multiplier instead of FSB..seems more stable too me.

[Juan]

For the PIII 1.2Ghz, Radeon 9000 Pro, and 256 PC-133 the total came to 245.50(US) which converted to $385.80(Canadian).

[Max Power]

Where are you getting your prices man? According to pricewatch (it will probably be alittle more) it comes to 130$ US which is 205$ Canadain or 215$ US which is 340$ Canadain (with the Radeon 9000 Pro) and thats for a 1.2 Ghz P3 and PC133 256MB RAM. I'll eather get that or just the RAM and save up. Thanks guys.

[Juan]

I'm getting them from googlegear. Pricewatch pisses me off because all I can ever get from them is OEM's and I prefer the Retail box. Call me picky if you will but I like that longer warranty considered the amount of tuneups and just messin around things I do to my PC. I think googlegear is the cheapest for Retail stuff my friend.

[Max Power]

So the difference in price is Pricewatch: 340$ to 600 and something??? WTF?!!? I know there OEM but still! I am also not planning on getting the radeon 9000 pro until after I get the CPU and memory.

[Juan]

I converted the price I found and converted it into Canadian money. So it looked like 245.50 from US to Canadian. Did I do it right? Remember I'm here in the US

[Max Power]

Mayby I dont know... hmmmm, Im sure its not that much its suppose to be about an extra 60$ (actully a little less then 60$) for each 100$. You must have done something wrong. So, Is this good stuff? Or should Iget something alittle cheaper?

[Joe]

pc133 is lame <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif" border="0"> .. just hold your horses till you can afford ddr.

[Max Power]

*crys* i don't need to be the fastest like you guys I just want to be able to play my current games with more stuff turned on and a higher res. And if I want to play new games then I'll do a full upgrade which will probably be sometime next year.

[Joe]

ALL i am saying is why waste the money now when you can just save it and buy a bettersystem next year .. i am not saying buy all this stuff now ... your wasting your money if you buy this crap you want now ... and you really arent gonna notice that big of a difference .. keep your current processor .. pick up like a nother 128stick and that vid card and be done with it till you have the cash for a new system

[Max Power]

ok

[Max Power]

Intel P3 1.2GHz FCPGA 256K 133FSB-200$<BR>256MB PC133 SDRAM-80$<BR>60GB Maxtor 7200rpm ATA/100-140$<BR>ATI RADEON 9000 PRO-200$<BR><BR>That is the most expensive prices that I will get, I will probably get it for much cheaper.