Water Cooling - In a Big Way [Archive]

Avid6eek

10-22-05, 10:39 PM

The Hydor L35 - A high end aquarium pump that is used in computer water cooling. It pumps 320 gallons per hour of water.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/hydor.jpg

My custom pumping solution. My new water cooling system will have two of these...each of them pumping just over 1,400 gallons per hour.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/sump.jpg

Any questions? Didn't think so :p :D

NotMyBest2Day

10-23-05, 12:36 AM

The theory sounds great, but I would think that if you make the water flow too fast through the blocks and such, then it will create too much turbulence and actually degrade performance. It's kind of like a fan when you make it spin too fast, you get cavitation and it actually pushes less air. Unless you're going to go with 3/4" or 1" fittings on the blocks, I would have to say that the aquarium pump idea would be the equivalent of shooting a mosquito with an elephant gun. :rolleyes:

I could be wrong though. Go ahead and try it and post the results.

Avid6eek

10-23-05, 12:48 AM

Through a water cooling system turbulent flow is what you want. This allows more water to come in contact with the surface area of the water block. If water simply glides through the water block, the same water molecules will be in contact with the copper surface of the water block on it's whole trip through the block. I don't know if I'm explaining it well enough to understand. Speed and turbulance is key to pulling the most heat from a water block.

NotMyBest2Day

10-23-05, 02:50 AM

I hope you'll have a monster rad then. I was just thinking about it again and the thermostat in my brother's truck was sticking, and we just decided to take it out and not replace it so the cooling would run wide open. This actually made the temp warmer than when the thermostat worked. The reason for that is the thermostat also reduces the diameter of the pipe, so it limits the flow. Without it, the water goes through the rad too fast to cool off enough before going back in.

Just something to think about.

Avid6eek

10-23-05, 02:57 AM

That shouldn't have happened. It doesn't matter how fast the liquid is flowing through the system. If it leaves the radiator fast, it will get back just as fast. If half of the distance through your water cooling system is through the radiator, no matter how fast the water is moving it will spend half its time in the radiator.

dantheman

10-23-05, 01:41 PM

I'm sure you'll have to be much more carefull about leaks with this solution. By the way where did you get that huge pump?

Avid6eek

10-23-05, 05:28 PM

It's a continuous duty AC sump pump. Picked it up at Home Depot for $65. The small DC pump I'm using in my rig right now cost more than the big pump. The brass plumming work on top of it was extra. I just picked up a second pump at Home Depot today. Each pump is going to have two outlet barbs. going to the various system components.

in54n3

10-23-05, 08:08 PM

avid, you're a nut.

:P

Avid6eek

10-23-05, 08:53 PM

I'm a nut....I just purchased the system radiator - 23" x 12" of double pass copper radiator with a beautiful stainless steel shroud :D

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/Lytron01.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/Lytron02.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/Lytron03.jpg

It's going to be cooled with two 1700cfm high performance automotive radiator fans

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/radfan.jpg

People are going to need phase change just to keep up with my water cooling setup :D

stangz

10-24-05, 02:42 AM

So much for it being quiet in his room anymore ... I give it 1 hour before his mom tells him to shut it off :p

chris000001

10-24-05, 07:55 AM

he should mount the pumps and Rad outside and have tubes feeding in...altho i dont kno how well that would work in New York....just an idea tho

Avid6eek

10-24-05, 11:11 AM

So much for it being quiet in his room anymore ... I give it 1 hour before his mom tells him to shut it off :pHa! I've got a plan for the noise. I'll post pictures once the whole setup is complete.

Skorp

10-24-05, 11:39 AM

Twelve inch fans? You'll need a couple more to handle that TEC. :p

jimmyt

10-24-05, 06:45 PM

wow ur just getting crazyer by the day :p

Avid6eek

10-24-05, 08:07 PM

I may have as many as 4 TECs in the system. A regular triple 120mm rad/fan combo could handle the heat without a problem, but I want it to be even more extreme then that. It's going to be at least a couple weeks until I get this sytem going. This week I'm doing nothing but cramming for midterms.

PCgeek

10-24-05, 10:24 PM

Actually shiz, turbulence increases performance, but only to a certain point. After that the water goes to fast to make contact with the block and actually pull heat off. If you want high flowing pumps, you are going to need high flowing blocks and rad. Looks like u got the rad covered, but you might want to look into a custom block thats like 3 inches thick and you might also want to look into 1" tubing...

EDIT - That pump takes just 2.57 seconds to pump a WHOLE GALON of water... I hope you know exactly what you're doing cause that's gonna be a hell of a lot of pressure in that cooling system.

Avid6eek

10-24-05, 10:30 PM

Actually shiz, turbulence increases performance, but only to a certain point. After that the water goes to fast to make contact with the block and actually pull heat off. You lost me here. The water goes to fast to make contact with the block? The water never loses contact with the block as there is no air in the system. At any point the block is 100% full of water.

NotMyBest2Day

10-24-05, 10:46 PM

Water, air..everything has a certain amount of time it takes to absorb energy (heat), and also get rid of it in a radiator. Density plays a big part in this. More dense = longer time to absorb/expel energy. I'm sure you've noticed that air heats up and cools off faster than water, and water heats up and cools off faster than a chunk of steel. That's what I was trying to tell you earlier on in the thread about how the water was going too fast through the radiator to cool off enough before going back in and getting more heat.

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 07:40 AM

NotMyBest2Day...I understand what your saying. The faster the water is flowing, the less time it is being spent in the radiator to cool off. It seems like you are missing the fact that the water is also spending less time in the water blocks to gain heat.

Increasing the water flow is the same as placing a faster fan on your heatsink. You are pumping more of what you need to absorb the heat energy, whether it be air or water. As you increase the fan speed on the heatsink you lower your temperatures. This rate of thermal dissapation is only limited by how fast the heatsink can transfer heat from the heat source to the fins. Basically, the faster you get the fan moving, the lower your temps will be. This rate continues until you are limited by the heatsink metal.

AMDfan

10-25-05, 09:51 AM

First off Avid i wanna congratulate you for being so courageous. However, i foresee a flaw. The ideal solution is a liquid passing through your PC with a high specific heat capacity so it can carry away more thermal energy. The drawback is that it takes time for this energy to conduct into the water so you cant have your water passing through too fast. This i believe is the problem you will face. To solve it you can pass the water through a tube with a larger diameter to slow it down or use a smaller pump.

Lastly, good luck with your ambitious project and i hope you succeed

joims

10-25-05, 01:27 PM

shiz is right you are wrong,

Okay 10 particles get 10 Wats of heat transwfered to each of them inthe one second it takes htem to pass thru the block

100 particles each recieveing 1 watt of energy taking jsut half a second thru the block woudl be more effective as in 2 seconds it can get twice as much done

you ppl think there is time required for the transfer of heat from one molecule to another it is an almost instantaneous transfer of energy when 2 molecules collide

hope that cleared it up for you
notation more turbulence is equally a good tihng as if one molecule hits the copper bounces of and is moving madly already it has more of a chance of transfering its heat to another molecuel meaning the enerrgy is spread out more allowing more heat to be transfered faster

srry this is a bit messy i hope u get the idea i am about to go out

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 03:02 PM

Finally...someone who gets what I'm talking about :)

NotMyBest2Day

10-25-05, 03:04 PM

You can shut everybody up once and for all with some actual results, too. ;) I know it'll be a short while for that though, but I at least can wait patiently.

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 05:50 PM

You can shut everybody up once and for all with some actual results, too. ;) I know it'll be a short while for that though, but I at least can wait patiently. It will be two weeks at the earliest that I have any kind of results. I've got lots of building to do, and still have some parts that I cannot find yet so I haven't even ordered. Some stuff just started arriving yesterday, so at least the excitement is building :)

Viper409

10-25-05, 09:35 PM

So, any details on the CPU that is going to be used? My guess is an MP system, since you have FOUR (4) CPU blocks listed on your website. Just a hunch tho. ;)

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 09:49 PM

I'm still missing a few parts to the system. It won't be an MP system, but it will use 5 water blocks :D

gokusimpson

10-25-05, 10:06 PM

I'm still missing a few parts to the system. It won't be an MP system, but it will use 5 water blocks :D

5?!?!

Some poor homeless kids in the world don't have any....

**im not homeless, but i still don't have one.... :D :D ;) ;)

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 10:23 PM

1 - Processor
1 - System RAM
1 - Chipset
2 - Video Card

gokusimpson

10-25-05, 10:26 PM

You need it for your ram too? I'll bet they're mushkin redlines...

Avid6eek

10-25-05, 10:57 PM

You need it for your ram too? I'll bet they're mushkin redlines... That's a pretty good guess, but I'm not going to give up any details until I've got results. I don't want to be wondering around this place like Shinobi claiming to have phase change cooling and a 7800GTX, yet there are no benchmarks to prove he's got anything.

ancient46

10-25-05, 11:52 PM

The ancient one would like to know about the water pressure this system will create. Will the blocks, fittings and tubing withstand the pressure you will be creating? What about back pressure on the pumps when the system is turned off? Seems to me that check valves might be a good idea. Also a pressure relief bypass might also be a good idea to protect the pump motors from overload. All in all it is a very intriguing project that I will be on the lookout for updates.

What's next a geothermal heat exchanger for the system?

gokusimpson

10-25-05, 11:53 PM

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 12:17 AM

We should start a bet on what parts are gonna be in ur rig. I gots no (spare hehe) money so we'll bet with something...taking suggestions on betting "chips".

I'm gunning for:

Mushkin Redlines
X1800XT Crossfire Well...I had Muskin Redline PC4000 memory in my rig I just sold, but I sold the system with Muskin TCCD memory in it, so it's a pretty safe bet that the gig of Redline I have will end up in the new rig. This will also be a single graphics solution. It'd be awfully hard to run crossfire in an nForce 4 motherboard. :p

gokusimpson

10-26-05, 12:39 AM

Well...I had Muskin Redline PC4000 memory in my rig I just sold, but I sold the system with Muskin TCCD memory in it, so it's a pretty safe bet that the gig of Redline I have will end up in the new rig. This will also be a single graphics solution. It'd be awfully hard to run crossfire in an nForce 4 motherboard. :p

so ur running with an Nf4? hmm

2x7800GTX duh.

bluegreenshxt

10-26-05, 01:24 AM

so ur running with an Nf4? hmm

2x7800GTX duh.

Nah, only 2 blocks for the vid card, one for GPU and one for GDDR. Should be an X1800...overclocks real well ;)

Doubt if this will fit in a normal case so he might use that wide open case he used with his MSI mobo.

Mobo = DFI nForce SLI expert?! I don't see that at newegg yet. But overclockablility and room for the chipset block....

Sound, can't see him using anything other than an X-FI...Fatality maybe?!

CPU - Can't see an FX...maybe not even dual core...3700+?!

cyrille_no1

10-26-05, 10:08 AM

ancient46

10-26-05, 11:22 AM

Sound=Creative X-FI Avid6eek, of course. Watercooled

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 11:27 AM

Sound=Creative X-FI Avid6eek, of course. Watercooled LOL. I haven't found any x-Fi Avid6eek's yet, but I'll keep looking :)

AKHandyman

10-26-05, 01:55 PM

I am always amazed at what you do Avid6eek and it behooves me to ask...do you ever sleep? It just seems to me that with all of what you have built, are building and the time it takes to test everything, either you have a caffiene IV; you sleep while you're standing up or you just don't have a personal life at all :D

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 04:43 PM

Well...I work 40 hours a week with 10 hour shifts Monday -Thursday, and I'm a full time college student. That sucks up most of my time. Having every Fri-Sun off allows for a very healthy social life, with lots of time left over for computer work.

BAM!

10-26-05, 07:00 PM

has the problem of backpressure ever cross your mind? it could be a bit risky running a pump that powerful. better make sure your tubes and harnesses can handle all that extreme pressure.

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 08:33 PM

Yes, I have thought about that. From the testing I've done so far I don't think it will be a problem, but I will continue to look into it before I run it with hardware.

NotMyBest2Day

10-26-05, 08:37 PM

As you learned with a watercooling setup in your main rig, I believe, leak-test the system for a couple of days before putting it in the rig. ;)

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 09:12 PM

As you learned with a watercooling setup in your main rig, I believe, leak-test the system for a couple of days before putting it in the rig. ;) Very true...that definetly wasn't a fun experience.

omga14

10-26-05, 09:21 PM

i know exactly what motherboard your going to use shiz:D it doesn't take an expert to know how you role ;)

i'd say get cathar over at XS to design you the waterblocks but that would cost crazy money. you would know that you were getting the best blocks for you particular setup though.

Avid6eek

10-26-05, 09:58 PM

i know exactly what motherboard your going to use shiz:D it doesn't take an expert to know how you role ;) You have no idea which motherboard I'm going to use :p

As for the water block, I already found the perfect combo for what I'm doing. It is the Swiftech MCW6002. A typical water block focuses on the center of the block where the CPU core is. This is great for cooling a processor because the heat is centered in one location. Using a TEC I need a water block that can absorb heat really well through the whole bottom of the heatsink. The swiftech block does this best because it allows for waterflow through the whole block, and isn't very restrictive so it'll work well in the high flow environtment I'm setting up.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/extc01.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/extc02.jpg

Of course I lapped it so it has a perfectly flat surface

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/extc03.jpg

The waterblock base fits perfectly over my 350w TEC. The 320w versions I have are a little smaller, but still fit nicely under the block.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/extc04.jpg

gokusimpson

10-27-05, 12:17 AM

You have no idea which motherboard I'm going to use :p

I think i do have an idea what mobo you are going to use...but then maybe not. You gots only one cpu water block...but I still think I know which one you will use...maybe...ish.

Could you watercool an X-fi? It IS clocked at 400mhz...so I guess it can be oc'ed.

§hinoßi

10-27-05, 05:00 AM

WTF ARE U GONNA GET FROM OCing UR SOUND?? FASTER.....ERM, SOUND??

Avid6eek

10-27-05, 07:46 AM

WTF ARE U GONNA GET FROM OCing UR SOUND?? FASTER.....ERM, SOUND?? LOL...Can you OC a sound card? I've never heard of it. §hinoßi makes a valid point so I guess I wouldn't do it even if I could.

Skorp

10-27-05, 09:51 AM

As for the water block, I already found the perfect combo for what I'm doing. It is the Swiftech MCW6002. A typical water block focuses on the center of the block where the CPU core is. This is great for cooling a processor because the heat is centered in one location. Using a TEC I need a water block that can absorb heat really well through the whole bottom of the heatsink. The swiftech block does this best because it allows for waterflow through the whole block, and isn't very restrictive so it'll work well in the high flow environtment I'm setting up.
Trouble with that is you'll have to cut your own neoprene. Why opt for that when Swiftech also do a kit? All the neoprene supplied cut to the exact shapes, with a TEC and an extra copper block, for use on 754/939/940.

EDIT: It seems i've not read this thread in a while. 4 CPU blocks? How can any one of those cool the RAM? I havent a clue what you're gonna do here, but it will be a mod beyond anything i've ever seen.

On that note, nobody has pointed out that he's gonna be using BH-5 DIMMs. (Well, it makes sense.) Those chips, when volted enough, can give 2-2-2-5 at greater than 250MHz, but they emit large amounts of heat when doing so. Conversely TCCDs hate extra voltage, so watercooling would be wasted, and those are the only two DDR RAM chips that are good enough to bear mention. Its not gonna be DDR2, because no such modues emit any worthwile heat at all, and he'd have to go Intel. (agh!) Most have probably already figured that out, but i'm Captain Obvious in my free time.

Avid6eek

10-27-05, 03:02 PM

Cutting Neoprene isn't a problem. Only takes a few minutes. I prefer my own custom work anyways. The TECs that come in the swiftech kits don't offer the cooling capacity that I am looking for.

1337NuB5!

10-30-05, 09:30 AM

I would say that you could use the Gigabyte DDR2-DDR Memory converter, but....its only for a certain Gigabyte mobo, and most likely not the mobo your using, and its Intel and Intel is the devil(according to most people on these forums)

§hinoßi

10-30-05, 09:42 AM

why are u doing this avid, isnt the cooling of a side of TEC correcspondant to the amount of electricity on the other side? Your gonna kill ur electric bill, just get a mach 2 gt dammit

Avid6eek

10-30-05, 10:14 AM

why are u doing this avid, isnt the cooling of a side of TEC correcspondant to the amount of electricity on the other side? Your gonna kill ur electric bill, just get a mach 2 gt dammitThe difference between TEC cooling and and phase change is at least $600. I won't use enough electricity to make up for that.

§hinoßi

10-30-05, 12:04 PM

i just bought a r404a mach 2 gt for $600

how much does your whole tec kit cost?

Avid6eek

10-30-05, 07:56 PM

Even if I had a phase change cooler I'd still need a water cooling setup for at least the chipset/gpu. Add in a water block for the CPU ($40) and a TEC ($18) and you are quite a bit below the cost of phase change.

I also wouldn't buy a used/modified phase change from anyone unless I bought it directly from Chilly1.

BAM!

10-30-05, 09:24 PM

i never had very much luck with that block on my previous epox nf3 board. for some reason the screw that came with the block was just wayyyyy too short to allow the block to be fasten onto the bracket. eventually after hours of fooling around, i had to take off the safety spring on the block and use only the screw to fasten the block. wasn't very pleasant.

§hinoßi

10-30-05, 10:35 PM

Stone Fox

10-31-05, 04:25 AM

I seem to remember someone having a signature that said something along the lines of "water cooling is like unprotected sex - on spill and you're f**ked...!"

If the blocks / tubing can't handle the pressure, that's going to be a bit more than a 'spill' I'd be standing on something rubber when I turned that thing on...!

But anyway, good on ya shiz. It's nice to see your particular brand of creative insanity shining through!

GO SHIZ!

GO SHIZ!

Avid6eek

10-31-05, 08:55 AM

true dat shiz, then again, you could always buy another prommy, it would spank TEC!! You've got a prommy and I don't see you spanking my scores. Put your prommy where your mouth is! :p

Avid6eek

10-31-05, 11:27 AM

Heat Exchanger arrived today...

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytron03.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytron04.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytron05.jpg

joims

11-01-05, 09:52 AM

it looks as if a pipe on either side(top bottom) is getting hardly any air blown on to it directly

what sthe point of that casing, would be better i htink if it was cut tso there was jsut enough to hold the fans incplace and then expose more of the pipes to air.....

Avid6eek

11-01-05, 12:12 PM

I just received the fans for the system this morning. I do plan on removing the shroud that came with it to allow for maximum airflow. The way it is designed even the pipes on the end would receive a good amount of airflow. There is about 1.5" between the shroud and the core. With two fans pushing 1700cfm of air that whole area between the shround and core would be filed with backpressure and air would be forced through the whole radiator.

Avid6eek

11-01-05, 09:11 PM

pwnage

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/autofans2.jpg

§hinoßi

11-01-05, 09:39 PM

lol shiz, ur a monster

Avid6eek

11-01-05, 10:51 PM

I'm waiting for your performance numbers so I know what I'm competing against. So far things are coming together on schedule. I still have to purchase a motherboard, video card, and possibly a CPU, but I'm in no rush. I've still got lots of things to finish with the cooling system. I've also run out of money. :rolleyes:

NotMyBest2Day

11-01-05, 11:40 PM

Haha! Shiz's money tree dropped all its leaves for the winter! :D

§hinoßi

11-01-05, 11:44 PM

ahaha shiz, you always say u run out of money. Then the next week you come up with like $500

to compete with ur new plans, i'd have to buy a 2nd prommy for the GPU hahaha.

So what kinda temps are you looking for with ur setup?

Avid6eek

11-02-05, 12:04 AM

§hinoßi

11-02-05, 12:59 AM

sigh....

PimpMySystem

11-02-05, 02:53 PM

I'm not lying when I say I've run out of money. I don't buy on credit. If I don't have the cash, I don't buy it. Usually I can come up with finances pretty quickly. I get paid tomorrow, and after I pay my car payment, cell phone, and broadband bill I should end up with $900 left over. That'll get me back in the shopping mood.

Nice i wouldnt mind having 900USD in a month why am i a kid AAARGh anyway
nice going i would like to ask you to not look to much at speed with the VGA
sinc your ocing is gonna be great better look at quality i mean with this that problems with soft shadow since speed and money wond be a prob the newest cards dont always bring best look

Avid6eek

11-05-05, 10:29 PM

Well...I began work on my exterior cooling unit today:

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit02.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytronmod04.jpg

after 6 dremel cutoff wheels and 8 drilled rivets:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytronmod05.jpg

4 more dremel cotoff wheels:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/lytronmod06.jpg

omga14

11-06-05, 12:31 AM

shiz you make me proud everytime you do some crazy shiz like this:D someone could use that as an intercooler for their car, lol. can't wait till i get to cali so i can start playing the lotto and finally spank that @$$.

if i win the lotto i'm gonna contact chilly1 and get a setup for each of the components, haha. that way i'll be -100C even on my chipset.

Avid6eek

11-06-05, 08:19 AM

Oh ************************...if you win the lotto you better send a little this way :D

Avid6eek

11-06-05, 10:19 AM

More Pics. The cooling unit is starting to come together nicely. The more I get built the more excited I am getting about finally getting this thing up and running. Still going to be a few weeks until I am able to, but the time will go by fast.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit05.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit06.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit07.jpg

NotMyBest2Day

11-06-05, 10:25 AM

I think it'll pass a better volume of air through the rad if the fans were mounted to the rad instead of having that big cavity between them. I can understand the logic of how you have it set up now, but it'll create too much turbulence with the air (air turbulence is bad) and not work as well as it could and should.

Other than that, it's looking pretty f'n awesome thus far. Good job!

[edit: nevermind..I think. Are yoiu pulling a vacuum in the cavity? If so then disregard the first paragraph. :o]

ElrichMeister

11-06-05, 11:02 AM

the reason i think he left a gap, is to eliminate the dead spot in the center of the fans

Avid6eek

11-06-05, 11:16 AM

It is more efficient to pull air through a radiator then it is to try and force it through. The fans are blowing out and will create a vacuum inside of the unit. This will allow for air to evenly flow through the radiator.

NotMyBest2Day

11-06-05, 11:20 AM

Yeah, I realized that after I posted. Temporary brainfart. ::smacks self::

chris000001

11-06-05, 07:10 PM

very nice craftsmanship!
what are the system specs gonna be?

gokusimpson

11-06-05, 07:43 PM

very nice craftsmanship!
what are the system specs gonna be?

He ain't telling. It's his secret project Liquid Ice. It's gonna rock though...unless the uber powerful pumps make the lines go pop. Then I'll just laugh.

NotMyBest2Day

11-06-05, 07:45 PM

Then I'll just laugh.Make that two for the "I'll just laugh" team. :p

Avid6eek

11-06-05, 08:10 PM

Just some updated Pics:

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit08.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit09.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit10.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit11.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit12.jpg

very nice craftsmanship!
what are the system specs gonna be?I don't even know what the exact specs are going to be yet so I haven't really talked about it. I don't want to say I'm going to do something and then do something totally different.

Avid6eek

11-07-05, 07:18 PM

Getting into the final stages now. Covering the whole thing with some weather resistant board...basically the same thing dry erase boards are made of.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit13.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit14.jpg

A picture of the 150w 11-13.5v 12.5A PSUs I'm using to power the fans and my TECs. I've got 14 of them which should provide me with more than enough power.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit15.jpg

AzN

11-07-05, 07:27 PM

Make that two for the "I'll just laugh" team. :p
Make it three now :D

stangz

11-07-05, 07:43 PM

AzN

11-07-05, 07:50 PM

I don't even know what the exact specs are going to be yet so I haven't really talked about it. I don't want to say I'm going to do something and then do something totally different.

Hmm... well i think the processor might be that opeteron that overclocks like a mofo.

gokusimpson

11-07-05, 07:56 PM

Oh ya...the opteron. Or he could have 2 opterons in the tyan mobo.

§hinoßi

11-07-05, 08:07 PM

have fun finding a CABNE opteron....unless.....HE BOUGHT IT OFF SOMEONE WITH HIS IMMEASURABLE FUNDS!!

OMGWTFHAX!!

bluegreenshxt

11-07-05, 08:14 PM

Hey Shiznit, you are waterproofing the setup and components, but what are you going to do to keep the water from freezing around it? Like blowing against the fan or radiator and just have a big chunk of ice around it ... just curious, but great work so far ...

He's using pelts. One side will be subzero, the other side will be uber hot. The water will be taking care of the hot side so he only has to take care of condensation w/ the cold side.

AzN

11-07-05, 08:25 PM

He's using pelts. One side will be subzero, the other side will be uber hot. The water will be taking care of the hot side so he only has to take care of condensation w/ the cold side.
Sounds reasonable. I just wanna see the finished product, specs and BENCHIES!!!!

Avid6eek

11-07-05, 08:33 PM

Hey Shiznit, you are waterproofing the setup and components, but what are you going to do to keep the water from freezing around it? Like blowing against the fan or radiator and just have a big chunk of ice around it ... just curious, but great work so far ...

Just drew a basic plan of how this thing will work when done:

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit00.jpg

The fans are going to pull air through the radiator. The incoming air will be sucked from under/behind the unit. The space behind the unit will be more than large enough to allow for adequate air to be sucked in. Because of where the air is being sucked in, it should limit the amount of water pulled into the system.

On the other side of the system where the fans are, air is being blown out at such a rapid rate that any water that dripped or ran off that side would simply be blown about 20 feet into my back yard.

In the event of a freeze up with ice, which is possible as water will be dripping from the roof all winter, the system would not get the airflow needed. This would cause the water in it to warm up, and eventually thaw itself out.

The antifreeze in the system is good down to -38F. It is possible that the system could get totally locked up if we have a very cold winter, but with all the heat I'm pumping into the water it would have to be extremely cold out to get the rad water down to -39F.

have fun finding a CABNE opteron....unless.....HE BOUGHT IT OFF SOMEONE WITH HIS IMMEASURABLE FUNDS!!

OMGWTFHAX!! I have two processors to play with, neither of them are a CABNE. The CABYE's are fairly are good as well...3.0Ghz stable on air.

Sounds reasonable. I just wanna see the finished product, specs and BENCHIES!!!! It's going to be at least a few weeks. The cooling unit is just a very small piece in the big picture and it's taking a week just to build that. I almost have all my hardware so I'll be working like hell to get some results as soon as possible.

AzN

11-07-05, 08:46 PM

The CABYE's are fairly are good as well...3.0Ghz stable on air.

Wtf????? where??!!?!?!?!?!?1

gokusimpson

11-07-05, 08:53 PM

I have two processors to play with, neither of them are a CABNE. The CABYE's are fairly are good as well...3.0Ghz stable on air.

Two procs...

Four procs later????
http://tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8qw.html

Tyan's whole lineup...very nice.
http://tyan.com/products/html/opteron.html

With such a nice cooling setup, I guess he could have 4 procs.

§hinoßi

11-07-05, 09:24 PM

so you are using opterons?

gokusimpson

11-07-05, 10:15 PM

I'm just guessing that he is going to use dual opterons cuz he has two, but you never know. He hasn't given specs yet.

§hinoßi

11-07-05, 10:34 PM

well hes gonna be socket 939, so maybe a dual core opteron. Something tells me that isnt it.

He probably found a way to make his comp run on 20 dollar bills

Avid6eek

11-07-05, 10:35 PM

Server motherboards suck for overclocking, so no I won't be using a dual Opteron setup.

§hinoßi

11-07-05, 10:37 PM

u know they are coming out with dual core 939 opterons....

gokusimpson

11-07-05, 10:39 PM

u know they are coming out with dual core 939 opterons....

They have 'em. Max PC used them in their DMX rig a few months ago.

AzN

11-07-05, 10:42 PM

They have 'em. Max PC used them in their DMX rig a few months ago.
Yup. that rig was fricken amazion. i love that case :D, but its 300 bucks :(

§hinoßi

11-07-05, 10:48 PM

yeah i couldnt remember if they came out or not...

Avid6eek

11-07-05, 10:51 PM

Today I spent some time playing with a dual core Opteron 170 at work. It ran a bit cooler than the 4400's we had at work a few weeks ago, but they are clocked 200Mhz slower. I don't have the hardware at work to test overclocking so I can't tell you how high it would go.

Stone Fox

11-08-05, 03:47 AM

Make it three now :D

And four. :)

Although, I hope it doesn't.

Avid6eek

11-08-05, 10:49 PM

I ran out of $$$ again :mad: I don't get paid until the 16th so I don't know if I'll get everything done on time. Frustrating to say the least!

AzN

11-08-05, 11:13 PM

cant u borrow some from your gf???

Avid6eek

11-08-05, 11:21 PM

cant u borrow some from your gf???Ha! I am the type of person who never buys on credit...she is the type that lives on credit. She has no money to lend me!

§hinoßi

11-09-05, 05:42 AM

omg shiz has no money for 7 days!! ITS THE 7th SIGN OF THE APOCALYPSE!!

Avid6eek

11-09-05, 07:33 AM

Yeah...it really sucks. I'm not worried about it because I have enough stuff to keep me busy. I may even be able to push out some kind of initial CPU/Memory scores.

§hinoßi

11-09-05, 08:04 AM

thats cool, the psu died on my mach 2 gt, so I need to learn how to connect it to another psu. I cant say im glad it happened, but at least ill learn alot about phase change (connections, etc) in the process. And maybe by the time im done ill have some benchies :D

*Benchies due out Q4 2008*

For now im gonna see what I can get outta my vid card so I can at least be on the top of our 3dmark 05 charts :D

Since I have power now but no internet, ill get 3dmark as high as I can, tell you guys the score, then when internets up Ill post it :D

Anywho, back to work, Ill have those benchies by the end of the year.....

Avid6eek

11-09-05, 08:49 AM

I already have an air conditioner all taken apart and one of these days I plan to begin work on my own phase change cooler. That will probably end up being a summer project as I am too busy with school right now and the TEC/Water setup will get me through winter.

omga14

11-09-05, 10:28 PM

They have 'em. Max PC used them in their DMX rig a few months ago.
was that max pc or maximum pc. google can't seem to find me the right link for the DMX(i'm supposing this was thier Dream Machine 10). i'd like to see what they came up with that i could in no way afford.

AzN

11-09-05, 11:06 PM

ya. its the dream machine 10. it cost 10k haha.

gokusimpson

11-09-05, 11:57 PM

maximum pc. I couldn't find anything on their site so here are the specs:

2x AMD Opteron 275
Tyan K8WE
Silverstone TJ07
8x Corsair 1gb registered modules
2x nVidia 7800GTX
2x Dell 2405FPW
PC Power and Cooling TC 850 SSI
5x Hitachi Deskstar 7K500 500gb drives
SATA Netcell Revolution
2x Plextor 716SA
Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi
Logitech Z-5500
Metadot Das Keyboard
Logitech MX518 (it's a great mouse but i think they could do better)
Windows XP Pro

$12,870 beans for this system. I think that's more than even shiz has....oh wait he ran out of money like yesterday. :D :D

AzN

11-10-05, 12:05 AM

oh wait he ran out of money like yesterday. :D :D
hahahahhahahahahaha

Avid6eek

11-10-05, 07:35 AM

For $12K that system sucks. You can't overclock or tweak server motherboards so it's a total waste of money.

AKHandyman

11-10-05, 02:45 PM

For $12K that system sucks. You can't overclock or tweak server motherboards so it's a total waste of money.

Yea, but wouldn't it be nice if you could?

§hinoßi

11-10-05, 05:04 PM

i like that storage space hahaha

yahooadam

11-11-05, 04:50 AM

For $12K that system sucks. You can't overclock or tweak server motherboards so it's a total waste of money.
who needs to OC a system like that :D

I forsee tubes coming off water blocks and with 2 pumps like that, can somone say house remodeling ??

@shinobi
Stop making excuses and give up and tell us allready u dont have a mach2

Avid6eek

11-11-05, 03:16 PM

Well...I'm bustin my ass here trying to get at least parts of my cooling system up and running. Right now it's a nice 37F (3C) outside and we're shooting for a low tonight of around 19F (-7C). I could at least start to post some numbers as I have everything I need except for the video card yet.

§hinoßi

11-11-05, 03:37 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6814478108

email suwanneetree, and i will reply saying, "I am Shinobi"

Avid6eek

11-11-05, 07:47 PM

Huh? That's yours, or your going to buy that?

yahooadam

11-11-05, 08:06 PM

i would understand that as he is selling it

so basically he couldnt keep up with u shiz so hes giving up

if he ever took it out the box that is

pressure might have gotten to him ;)

Nova

11-11-05, 08:29 PM

yahooadam

11-11-05, 08:58 PM

ready, steady, go!

he is bidding for it foo :p

the seller wants canadian, shinobi prolly din't even know canadian dollars existed :p

i'm guessing he needs a new prommy since he blew out the power supply on the one he owns, you know back when he had no power :p

he woulda posted pics of his prommy if he actually had one just to shut you all up

and lastly, i know the company went out of business and came back in, but isnt that asking a bit much? i mean din't they sell for 475$ way back when.
oh right - looking again he has bid

:lol: not like he isnt going to get outbid anyway, plus hes not met the reserve

BTW is it just me or is
reserve is set at $700 CDN ~$590 US
stupid, just set the starting price at 700 !!!! :confused:

Avid6eek

11-11-05, 09:30 PM

I guess your right Nova...all this talk of his Prommy, he's going to have to buy one or we won't leave him alone until we see phase change results from him.

omga14

11-11-05, 10:47 PM

§hinoßi

11-12-05, 05:17 AM

if you read the sellers name backwards its obvious that it isnt me, and as you can see from the ENDED sign that ive already won it.

After I get that working, im gonna get like a Mach1 or a Vapo SS for the gpu. ************************, maybe ill just get a chilly1 custom job :D

yahooadam

11-12-05, 10:35 AM

and i thought he already had one.

on the DMX rig, why would anyone ever need 2.5tb of hdd space? it would take years without deleting anything to collect enough of that precious "data" we all search for. i don't even thing professional movie guys have close that much space for thier editing/encoding jobs. also shiz was right, what enthusiast would build a rig he couldn't decently overclock?
lol sounds pointless to me

even my space is massive overkill
i only have 4 HDD's so i can store data in parralel over them

ive used 267.4 GB

Says the user shinobi claims to be has won it, just proves he never had 1 ;)

Avid6eek

11-12-05, 10:35 AM

I haven't posted any updated pics in a while because I've been using all my free time to build. The external cooling unit is done, and now I'm working on the internal system.

From the outside:

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem004.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem005.jpg

From the inside:

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem001.jpg

I am going to have 4 cooling lines...

Line 1 - Processor (350w Peltier)
Line 2 - Chipset / System Memory (320w Peltier)
Line 3 - Front of Graphics Card (320 Peltier)
Line 4 - Back of Graphics Card (320w Peltier)

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem002.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem003.jpg

NotMyBest2Day

11-12-05, 10:38 AM

Hey, your pictures don't work. :p

[edit: damn, beat me to it. :mad:]

yahooadam

11-12-05, 10:52 AM

1) your crazy
2) your neighbours are/should kill you
3) lol whats wrong with the outside of ure house/apartment
4) your crazy

Avid6eek

11-12-05, 10:58 AM

2) your neighbours are/should kill you
The fans don't seem so loud outside, though it is pretty obvious I'm up to something.
3) lol whats wrong with the outside of ure house/apartment New siding is being put on the house so some of the insulation board is exposed...that energy shield crap.

§hinoßi

11-12-05, 12:13 PM

lol sounds pointless to me

even my space is massive overkill
i only have 4 HDD's so i can store data in parralel over them

ive used 267.4 GB

Says the user shinobi claims to be has won it, just proves he never had 1 ;)

this is actually my second unit. I had a vapochill SE that I never used lol.

bluegreenshxt

11-12-05, 02:16 PM

Hehehee, I can imagine birds loving to sit on his cooling system :D :D

It doesn't look too stable though...might wanna be careful if it get's windy from storms or something.....hail won't be good either...

§hinoßi

11-12-05, 02:17 PM

....i dont get it?

yahooadam

11-12-05, 02:31 PM

Avid6eek

11-12-05, 04:59 PM

Updated Pics....$400 worth of hardware with permanently void warranties :D

Stripped down SLI-DR Expert:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem006.jpg

SLI-DR Expert after two coats of clear laquer to prevent any condensation issues:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem007.jpg

Muskin Redline PC4000 and some lapped copper bars:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem008.jpg

Laquered Muskin Redline PC4000:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem009.jpg

Arctic Ceramique:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem010.jpg

Clamped Redline:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem011.jpg

Clamped Redline w/ silicone seal:
http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingsystem012.jpg

AzN

11-12-05, 06:56 PM

ooooooooo. i wanna do that to ram too. keep the pics going! :D

Avid6eek

11-12-05, 07:38 PM

Well...I've hit my first major with the cooling system. I took a look outside to find water dripping from the unit. After looking a little closer inside the unit through the fan grils I found that I never sealed the connections to the radiator. The hoses are connected, but with no silicon or clamps.

At least one thing this does is bring and end to the theory that the lines will have too much pressure in them. The hoses aren't going to burst, and they don't even need clamps to stay connected. Of course, I was only running a single pump this evening, but I feel confident that a second one isn't going to increase the pressure very much.

The main reason this is such a problem is that the unit is extremely heavy now that it is full of water, so removing it from the window is going to be very hard. There is also no way for me to get to the connections that need clamps. Everything is sealed up with liquid nails so it isn't moving. It's gonig to end up being more of a demolition than a re-entry.

So far mistakes have costed me:

Cooling Unit Leaks:
$30 in parts to repair + a day of my time to work on it

Hardware:
$200 - Muskin Redline.

It's been an expensive day. Time to take a break.

Nova

11-12-05, 08:11 PM

question. since when does the chipset look like a cpu?

statement. those are some fat @$$ copper bars.

omga14

11-12-05, 08:29 PM

what did they look like to you before?

Nova

11-12-05, 08:32 PM

if memory serves right, http://www.digit-life.com/articles/roundupfeb2k1/chipset.jpg

big plastic thing, and then they tossed coolers on em, never seen them with an open core like that.

i guess i'm in the stoneage or something.

AzN

11-12-05, 08:37 PM

man... that sucks.... but how did you screw up ur ram?>

omga14

11-12-05, 11:31 PM

ok, first rig i built looked like a IHS cpu.

Stephane

11-13-05, 12:25 AM

I wonder if moving the water too fast is not an inefficient way of cooling?

My reasoning is that if the water goes too fast over the block, it will not have time to collect the heat, and in the same fashion, will not have time to spread it out in the radiator.
I would assume that the water has to have time to transfer the heat energy.

What buddy was saying about the truck thermostat is not surprising. Without a thermostat, the water goes from the radiator to the block continuously without any real effect. If you put in place a thermostat, your engine has some water around the block to keep it at a consistent temperature (around 180 degrees).

When the temperature gets too high, the thermostat opens and let the water go to the radiator, gets cooled and goes back to the block to cool it down. If you let the water run continuously, your engine alway runs too cool and therefore has to run rich to compensate. Also, the heat is necessary to buildup the pressure (around 14PSI) which make the whole system a hell of a lot more efficient at transferring energy (heat). The proof is that if you leave the radiator cap open, you will not build any pressure and will not have an good working system.

With the thermostat in place, you not only control the temperature, but you also control the pressure and the speed at which the water cools or warms up and the speed of it's flow.

omga14

11-13-05, 02:34 AM

on the first or second page this is discussed. shoot back and see if anything changes your mind.

ElrichMeister

11-13-05, 03:56 AM

man shiz your nuts, lol, haha look at my little watercooling project lol, i posted some new pics lol, sorry for the thread jack, but man your water cooling is insane... i like it.

NotMyBest2Day

11-13-05, 08:24 AM

Hey shiz, if you want to just drain the box full of water, drill a hole or two in the bottom of it and let gravity do the work for you. You'll just have to keep topping off the resivoir.

yahooadam

11-13-05, 09:26 AM

Hey shiz, if you want to just drain the box full of water, drill a hole or two in the bottom of it and let gravity do the work for you. You'll just have to keep topping off the resivoir.
put a hose pipe in the res ;)

lol his pumps would pump the water too fast though ;)

Avid6eek

11-13-05, 10:03 AM

Hey shiz, if you want to just drain the box full of water, drill a hole or two in the bottom of it and let gravity do the work for you. You'll just have to keep topping off the resivoir. Right now I'm just using distilled water in the system for testing. I have to put anti-freeze in it within a couple days before the temps outside go below freezing. If I freeze up the radiator I'll probably destroy it. Because the system is going to have antifreeze I have to make sure there are no leaks. It's too expensive and toxic to let leak from the system. I am not doing anything with it today. I've got too much homework and other things to take care of.

Devils00Champs

11-15-05, 12:12 AM

when i thought i saw you do it all u defy any logic. That thing is damn amazing and crazy

Avid6eek

11-15-05, 07:34 AM

I started ripping it apart last night trying to find my leaks. The inside of the unit has some water damage but it only appears minor right now. I won't really know more about it until tomorrow night when I have time to get back to work on it.

Stone Fox

11-15-05, 08:40 AM

Here's a suggestion, try putting some dye / colouring (non corrosive!) in the system. Something in flurescent orange maybe? That should make the leak easier to find.

yahooadam

11-15-05, 11:51 AM

Here's a suggestion, try putting some dye / colouring (non corrosive!) in the system. Something in flurescent orange maybe? That should make the leak easier to find.
or put colouring everywhere and make a huge mess ;)

Avid6eek

11-15-05, 12:06 PM

If I did that then I'd have a colored leaky mess. I've found the leaks I've been looking for. It's just going to take a couple days to fix them. My faulty building is to blame. I used caulk on some seals in the tubing which wasn't the brightest idea. I should have been using silicone but I ran out. I hope to have the problem fixed by this weekend.

-=CrAnSwIcK=-

11-15-05, 10:39 PM

For some reason, i haven't checked this thread since there was like 1 or 2 pages...and i have to say.... :eek:

NotMyBest2Day

11-15-05, 10:53 PM

It's only page 4 for me (40 posts/page).

gokusimpson

11-16-05, 12:22 AM

I used caulk on some seals in the tubing which wasn't the brightest idea. I should have been using silicone but I ran out. I hope to have the problem fixed by this weekend.

I thought you would have enough money to buy yourself some more silicone....oh wait...u need that money to replace a redline. :D :D

Will u leave ur comp on all day and night or will you drag that wood thing back inside so the water doesnt freeze?

bluegreenshxt

11-16-05, 01:14 AM

I thought you would have enough money to buy yourself some more silicone....oh wait...u need that money to replace a redline. :D :D

Will u leave ur comp on all day and night or will you drag that wood thing back inside so the water doesnt freeze?

I think he's leaving it outside...don't know how much his pumps would like frozen water though.....

stangz

11-16-05, 02:50 AM

how did you actually fry the redline?

-=CrAnSwIcK=-

11-16-05, 02:51 AM

constantly circulating water wouldn't freeze would it?? especially since he's putting antifreeze in it...

And yeah, i'm a little curious as to what exactly happened to the redlines...

And again, from a guy who's air cooling a rig he built for under 400 bucks canadian......... :eek:

ROFL though, i'd still like to see two TEC/water cooled x1800xt's in crossfire....

yahooadam

11-16-05, 03:11 AM

as far as i remember he clipped the edge of one with a 2,400 rpm flywheel ...

-=CrAnSwIcK=-

11-16-05, 04:33 AM

ouch...that sucks for anyone, even if you got the money to throw away...

Lol, avid....900$ US surplus for fun.....I make 600$ CAD a month, and 300 goes to rent, and 65$ to cell phone...that explains my sig :o

yahooadam

11-16-05, 05:12 AM

§hinoßi

11-16-05, 06:13 AM

....yahoo u play css? OMFG ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO ME!!

come in digital homicide sometimes. its funzors!!

-=CrAnSwIcK=-

11-16-05, 06:19 AM

*Ahem* Avid, let's see that redline you butchered, lol

NotMyBest2Day

11-16-05, 07:33 AM

Constantly flowing water has a lower freezing point, but it all depends on how fast it's moving as to how low the freezing point is.

I want to know/see what happened to the Redlines, too. :D

Avid6eek

11-16-05, 07:44 AM

Even though I butchered the redlines, they are still working! I will post pics when I can. I'll be at work all day today. I won't be home until 7pm tonight.

gokusimpson

11-16-05, 07:12 PM

....yahoo u play css?

doesn't everyone play cs?

That's some luck, shiz.

NotMyBest2Day

11-16-05, 08:17 PM

I don't play CS:S, but I'm not a FPS person either. I have no interest in them. I really don't do much gaming anymore. GTA3 finally got boring, even starting a new game is still boring. I need to find something else to play. I wish some of the Gran Turismo's had a PC version. That would rawk!

Avid6eek

11-16-05, 08:26 PM

GOOD NEWS: External water cooling unit is patched and working w/o any leaks :)

BAD NEWS: It's pretty warm outside today so I'm not going to be working with very cold water :(

GOOD NEWS: Got a TEC working on the processor and got temps as low as -2C in the BIOS :D

BAD NEWS: TEC was powered by three seperate power supplies. One power supply blew up in a puff of smoke, When the load transfered to the other two they fried up on me as well. 3 toasty PSUs :mad:

Once again, today was a very expensive day. I'm done tinkering for now.

Stone Fox

11-17-05, 04:23 AM

Ouch. Sorry to hear of your loss dude. But look on the brightside - there are worse (and more expensive) things that could have gone bang then your PSU's.

yahooadam

11-17-05, 05:06 AM

BAD NEWS: TEC was powered by three seperate power supplies. One power supply blew up in a puff of smoke, When the load transfered to the other two they fried up on me as well. 3 toasty PSUs :mad:
Sorry but

:D :D :D

Avid6eek

11-17-05, 08:27 AM

The powersupplies are $17 each so it's not so bad as long as I don't fry any more.

yahooadam

11-17-05, 12:33 PM

i wish i had money to - well burn ...

Avid6eek

11-17-05, 10:53 PM

Added a bit of insulation to the tubes as condensation was becoming an issue. I did test the motherboard and the water doesn't appear to have caused any major problems. It booted to the BIOS without a problem. My water temps with the system off where 36.9F. Now with the system on, with me at the desktop downloading driver updates/software the water temps remain at 36.9F.

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit21.jpg

http://hardware-geek.com/Pictures/coolingunit22.jpg

AzN

11-17-05, 11:05 PM

wow man... that looks sweet. maybe a little to messy for me lol. but its worth it :D. keep it up man!

Dawson

11-26-05, 12:24 PM

I have decided that your pumps are not strong enough and do not provide enough flow, Mr. Avid. No, sir; you need at least two Cal Torpedo pumps.

I think a total of 20,000 gph should be enough.

;)

I've really enjoyed reading through this thread and have learned quite a bit - thank you, Mr. Avid.

-=CrAnSwIcK=-

11-26-05, 06:38 PM

NotMyBest2Day

11-26-05, 06:55 PM

I think he's being a smart@ss..

Godd22

11-27-05, 01:07 AM

holy flying water droplets batman. I'd be worried about being outside cleaning snow or animal feces with that 'rad' box shooting water pelts which could freeze and produce his own hail machine, lol. Looks amazing for what it is. I think I've just convinced myself that I may be buying some new things for my computer. I just want a swiftech kit to cool my cpu and I might buy a 6800GS (Can't see me buying a 7800GTX right now) But I wish I could pay rent, a cell bill and have $900US left on my paycheck. I'm making about $600 per paycheck. Which isn't all that bad (someone must be working part time and not getting many hours if he's only making $600 a month, because the national average minimum wage is like $6.50 I think so even at that rate of pay and after taxes that's only about 100ish hours a month so 25 hours a week. My girlfriend works at mcdonalds and makes more than that. Muwahahha, all you silly Californians go to gnc and try to find umm, cold milled flax in these stupid yellow foil bags, I helped package those things. Muwahahha. Don't worry we are hygenic and comply with the rules enforced by your government and the bioterrorism act. Bahahahhahaha, I'm going crazy with posting all this nonsense, to bring it all back. Very cold setup you've got ;)

Avid6eek

11-27-05, 09:01 AM

Thanks!

The biggest problem I've got with the setup is it's so large, there are alot of places that leak because of temp extremes. The water temps so far have ranged anywhere from 65F to -5F. The expansion/contraction of all the different materials is causing me problems. With water at 40F everything works great...as soon as I go below that my chipset waterblock leaks. I'm going to have to get that under control before I can run the system anymore. The motherboard has been wet almost non-stop for the past couple weeks. I'm surprised it's still alive :)

NotMyBest2Day

11-27-05, 09:41 AM

It's still alive because you lacquered it, remember? :p

Avid6eek

11-27-05, 10:01 AM

I only laquered part of it. I'm going to have to sell this thing on eBay and buy myself a new one if I ever decide to use it in a more permanent rig. Never trust what you buy on eBay :D

NotMyBest2Day

11-27-05, 10:28 AM

Believe me, I don't buy computer parts off ebay. If it's not still in the factory cellophane, it's not worth my money.

yahooadam

11-27-05, 10:38 AM

Believe me, I don't buy computer parts off ebay. If it's not still in the factory cellophane, it's not worth my money.
i dont buy anything off ebay

to many bad experiences

and computer parts are allways a rip off

NotMyBest2Day

11-27-05, 10:47 AM

Yeah, too many ripoffs, and if there even is any kind of returns for DOA stuff, that's as far as it goes. No 30 days thing, no nice RMA service, nothing.

Stone Fox

11-28-05, 03:34 AM

Jeezus christ Avid. Have you seen how many views you've attracted with this thread?

yahooadam

11-28-05, 05:06 AM

Jeezus christ Avid. Have you seen how many views you've attracted with this thread?
COMON 5k :)

Avid6eek

11-28-05, 09:27 AM

Jeezus christ Avid. Have you seen how many views you've attracted with this thread? And I'm not even half way done with my project! I hope to get working on it again soon. I've been to lazy for the past week and haven't done anything but play games. :D

yahooadam

11-28-05, 11:48 AM

And I'm not even half way done with my project! I hope to get working on it again soon. I've been to lazy for the past week and haven't done anything but play games. :D
GET OFF URE ASS

better ? ;)

Nataku

11-28-05, 05:37 PM

Just WOW.

I've got it! avid is building a motorcycle! he already has the radiator off of one.

Hey guys It's been a long time! I've been busy with moving and buying my new car. My Car hoby has taken up much of my time.

Avid Nice to see you haven't changed. You're still crazier then ever.

Ok when I last left off, you had just finnished that nice tripple 120mm radiator silver/black case computer.

And Did I hear you say you were water cooling your RAM? Now I made a post before I left a few months back about that and you guys said it couldn't be done do to space requirements. What have I missed?

After seeing that silver/black case I think this isn't one of your best craftmanships here avid. But a great idea nun the less... And you stole my idea of the automotive radiator fans. Me, being a auto person was going to go that way as well.

Well, glad to be back guys.

yahooadam

11-28-05, 06:00 PM

Ok when I last left off, you had just finnished that nice tripple 120mm radiator silver/black case computer.

And Did I hear you say you were water cooling your RAM? Now I made a post before I left a few months back about that and you guys said it couldn't be done do to space requirements. What have I missed?
he finished that case so he sold it on ebay (said he was bored ;))

You can watercool ram but u need to make a custom cooler, you cant just shove a pipe on it

so hes having to attatch blocks of copper to the ram, then watercool those blocks

Nataku

11-28-05, 06:43 PM

You can watercool ram but u need to make a custom cooler, you cant just shove a pipe on it

I know my idea doesn't work. but you also said you couldn't mont blocks because there isn't enough room... is he just going to use 2 chips? or is there something hidden up his sleeve.

Dawson

11-28-05, 07:20 PM

To save you the time of searching through the thread, Nataku, you can see Avid's custom water blocks in this post: http://forum.pcstats.com/showpost.php?p=283223&postcount=138

So yeah, it looks like just two chips. Also, I believe he measured the blocks to fit perfectly together, then attached a peltier and waterblock to the whole assembley.

And I believe there was a small measure of confusion with my last post: I was being honest (with thanking Avid for his work). I really have learned alot from this thread, and was not attempting to be a smart @rse...

And Avid, if you don't mind my asking, what are those PSUs you are using? I've been searching for awhile for an inexpensive one, but have been unsuccessful.

Avid6eek

11-28-05, 08:22 PM

The Powersupplies are located at:

http://www.emtel.com/search/product_detail.asp?product_id=EMV15012V

I purchased 10+ of them so the pricing wasn't bad. You get 12.5 amps out of each one so I just wire up as many as I need to meet my amperage demands.

If you have any other questions about anything, let me know.

NotMyBest2Day

11-28-05, 11:19 PM

I might get one or two of those just for my fans and such. I'm sure theres almost no noise/interference on the output for those. This little DC adapter I have has a lot of noise on the output side. Not audible noise, electrical noise. It's kind of like having a little bit if static when listening to the radio.

Avid6eek

11-28-05, 11:55 PM

They can make some noise when they are under alot of load, but I don't think it's anything a fan is going to cause. I guess for the money it's worth as try.

yahooadam

11-29-05, 03:41 AM

I know my idea doesn't work. but you also said you couldn't mont blocks because there isn't enough room... is he just going to use 2 chips? or is there something hidden up his sleeve.
you probably could do it with 4 sticks but you then have to start mesauring really really accuratly as the memory has to be perfectly spaced, and your joining 2 memorys together with 1 of the blocks

Stone Fox

11-29-05, 03:51 AM

Natuku, did you see his adventures with liquid nitrogen cooling??

yahooadam

11-29-05, 04:00 AM

Natuku, did you see his adventures with liquid nitrogen cooling??
lol the ones that failed miserably ;)

you shoulda fixed that thing up avid, would have been much cooler :cool:

Stone Fox

11-29-05, 04:05 AM

yahooadam

11-29-05, 04:15 AM

Hmm, rather than cooling the CPU directly with the LN tower, maybe if he filled his water cooling system with antifreeze and used the LN to cool the fluid?

At what temp do you think most antifreeze gives up and freezes?
think its somming like -60°C

but it depends what concentration u use

if u used LN to cool the water it wouldnt work well, and i recon it would just freeze, anti-freeze or not

Stone Fox

11-29-05, 06:14 AM

and i recon it would just freeze, anti-freeze or not

So why call it "anti-freeze"? Why not just call it "freeze" :p

if you filled the system with antifreeze, and got the water to flow at a steady temp of around -50....

lol the ones that failed miserably ;):cool:

And it didn't fail - It entertained and shocked loads of people and Avid discovered one way NOT to cool a PC.

He also pushed the envelope on the RMA front... :)

yahooadam

11-29-05, 06:44 AM

So why call it "anti-freeze"? Why not just call it "freeze" :p
if you filled the system with antifreeze, and got the water to flow at a steady temp of around -50....
your talking about cooling water with liquid nitrogen
which boils off at around a mere -200 degrees (if my memory serves me correctly)

i dont care what anti-freeze u use thats gonna freeze !
plus it wouldnt be a particularly good way to cool

And it didn't fail - It entertained and shocked loads of people and Avid discovered one way NOT to cool a PC.

He also pushed the envelope on the RMA front... :)
it was ment to cool his system down so he could overclock alot
well he never managed to OC so it failed as it didnt do what it was supposed to ;)

Nataku

11-29-05, 12:45 PM

I saw his LN adventure right until he RMA'd the processor... what happened after that?

yahooadam

11-29-05, 12:48 PM

I saw his LN adventure right until he RMA'd the processor... what happened after that?
he got back the proc and ebayed it

the end of the LN project ..

Avid6eek

11-29-05, 02:32 PM

LN2 is very hard to work with with Athlon 64's because of the built in memory controller. This causes the infamous cold bug. One way around it was to alter the RAM drive strenght in the BIOS...a feature which has just become avialable on DFI's latest motherboards.

yahooadam

11-29-05, 04:41 PM

Avid6eek

11-29-05, 04:42 PM

The system will fail to boot, or if you boot it then poor in the Liquid N2 the system will just shut down.

yahooadam

11-29-05, 04:49 PM

weird

i would have thought at those temps the tracks in the CPU would shrink so much they would fracture

The Element Master

11-30-05, 12:04 PM

Nice work here.
very interesting project. happy that it suceeded.
The Element Master

Avid6eek

12-14-05, 12:03 AM

Well...I decided to check to see how well the system is holding up to the cold so far this fall, and it isn't so well. I just went to run the system and the pumps seemed to be working very hard, but they weren't pushing any water. After taking a look outside, it seems that the radiator is frozen solid. :rolleyes:

The current temperature is -5F outside (-20.5C). Just air cooling could get me phase change temps :)

bluegreenshxt

12-14-05, 02:49 AM

Aww, I was looking forward to seeing a crazier overclock :p

Maybe try something other than water...there are supposed to be water-like substances with much lower freezing pints...

Stone Fox

12-14-05, 04:47 AM

Higher Antifreeze content?

Avid6eek

12-14-05, 06:19 AM

Right now the mixture is about 90% water, 10% antifreeze. I'll have to switch it to 50/50. It usually doesn't get quite this cold yet.

Stone Fox

12-14-05, 06:31 AM

Right now the mixture is about 90% water, 10% antifreeze. I'll have to switch it to 50/50. It usually doesn't get quite this cold yet.

Good call. I hope you haven't fracture any of the pipes in the RAD when it froze!

yahooadam

12-14-05, 08:07 AM

doesnt antifreeze have a worse specific heat capacity and thermal conduction then water tho ?

Avid6eek

12-14-05, 11:04 AM

I use automotive antifreeze, which has addatives in it that increase the performance of the fluid, much like adding water wetter.

Skorp

12-14-05, 11:38 AM

doesnt antifreeze have a worse specific heat capacity and thermal conduction then water tho ?

Yes, but ice has a worse conductivity, in that it doesnt budge. :p

And if he can hold those temps at sub-zero, the coolant properties wont matter, specially with that many TECs.

EDIT: Another solution is to overclock more to balance the heat out!

yahooadam

12-14-05, 02:17 PM

EDIT: Another solution is to overclock more to balance the heat out!
exactly :p

NotMyBest2Day

12-14-05, 05:51 PM

Maybe try something other than water...there are supposed to be water-like substances with much lower freezing pints...Isopropyl Alcohol. Freeze at -170F, boil at 170F. It is less dense than water, so it will transfer the heat better and faster. I believe you can go to Home Depot and get it by the gallon. That was going to be my super-secret weapon for when I ever get around to milling my blocks and such, but I don't think that project is ever going to happen. :/

yahooadam

12-14-05, 05:56 PM

Isopropyl Alcohol. Freeze at -170F, boil at 170F. It is less dense than water, so it will transfer the heat better and faster. I believe you can go to Home Depot and get it by the gallon. That was going to be my super-secret weapon for when I ever get around to milling my blocks and such, but I don't think that project is ever going to happen. :/
uhh IPA boils at room temp dude ...

saurongt

12-14-05, 06:29 PM

uhh IPA boils at room temp dude ...

no... you might be thinking of ether.

omga14

12-14-05, 10:46 PM

99% Isopropyl Alchohol has a flash point of 50F. not a good idea:D especially if he smokes, haha. there is a fluid that was used by some gent over at xtremesystems that can handle -100C if i'm not mistaken and loose it's liquid state. heard it's kinda expensive and i don't know what it's viscosity is though so it may be real hard on the pumps if it's thick.

Stone Fox

12-15-05, 03:52 AM

Hmmm, Highly a volatile Petrochemical in a system full of hot components and electricals... :D

YEAH! That'll work!

Can you record it on a webcam? (from the next room if I were you...)

yahooadam

12-15-05, 01:20 PM

isopropyl alcohol C3H7OH 83° C

thats weird

but why does IPA evaporate away at room temp then ?

AKHandyman

12-15-05, 01:26 PM

Hmmm, Highly a volatile Petrochemical in a system full of hot components and electricals... :D

YEAH! That'll work!

Can you record it on a webcam? (from the next room if I were you...)
That's funny ... hope he can get it all in one take! :p

NotMyBest2Day

12-15-05, 10:08 PM

isopropyl alcohol C3H7OH 83° C

thats weird

but why does IPA evaporate away at room temp then ?Less dense than water, so it evaporates quicker than water does.

Avid6eek

12-15-05, 10:46 PM

It's supposed to get nice and warm tomorrow...around 28F. Hopefully that will allow my radiator to thaw.

Nataku

12-16-05, 12:29 AM

what about this stuff...

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1537266&CatId=499

just found it. maybe mixed with a little anti-freeze?

edit: actually this too, --40F freezing http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1537267&CatId=0

stangz

12-16-05, 02:31 AM

It's supposed to get nice and warm tomorrow...around 28F. Hopefully that will allow my radiator to thaw.
I had 3 inches of ice on my car before, the sh!t took 3 days to thaw with a kerosene heater blowing on it. Depending on how much is solid ice, it might take a while.

Break out the hair dryer:p

studbolt

12-16-05, 04:55 AM

I had 3 inches of ice on my car before, the sh!t took 3 days to thaw with a kerosene heater blowing on it. Depending on how much is solid ice, it might take a while.

Break out the hair dryer:p

Hair dryer??? And just how the hell is doing his hair gonna help?!?!?!?:D

Guess who's back Fockers

NotMyBest2Day

12-16-05, 07:33 AM

Bolt! Where the hell you been, man? Someone asked about your whereabouts in another thread a few weeks ago. Nobody knew. Glad to see you're back.

yahooadam

12-16-05, 08:50 AM

Break out the hair dryer:p
i wodner if the hairdryer can even get near his rad with that case around it

Avid6eek

12-16-05, 09:16 AM

It's completely thawed now. There is some anti-freeze in the water, so the melting point was probably around 20F.

stangz

12-16-05, 10:09 AM

It's completely thawed now. There is some anti-freeze in the water, so the melting point was probably around 20F.
Awesome!

omga14

12-16-05, 04:23 PM

ok, no more fooling around and letting it freeze so you can't do better with clocks. i expect 4ghz by wednsday:D

AKHandyman

12-16-05, 05:34 PM

It's supposed to get nice and warm tomorrow...around 28F. Hopefully that will allow my radiator to thaw.
Avid, you should consider moving to Alaska, and help me with outdoor sub-zero cooling that would really be called "ARCTIC COOLING!" Come on up, I'll even let you stay in my storage bus .. it's really nice ... :D

saurongt

12-17-05, 10:49 AM

Avid, you should consider moving to Alaska, and help me with outdoor sub-zero cooling that would really be called "ARCTIC COOLING!" Come on up, I'll even let you stay in my storage bus .. it's really nice ... :D

Yeah...put the case right in the window(the back facing inside), seal the hole around it and enjoy the nice fresh air heater. :D

yahooadam

12-17-05, 02:32 PM

Yeah...put the case right in the window(the back facing inside), seal the hole around it and enjoy the nice fresh air heater. :D
aye

until u get bugs coming in ;)

or its 60 degrees outside :p

saurongt

12-18-05, 12:11 AM

aye

until u get bugs coming in ;)

or its 60 degrees outside :p

Yeah..bugs. Nicely chopped by the fans and freshly cooked on the grill (heatsink). What a delicacy to devour!:D

omga14

12-18-05, 04:37 AM

yahooadam

12-18-05, 05:42 AM

i would like to eventually have a completely fanless system with that liquid that can handle -40C+ and mantain its viscosity. make a case with cooling coils inside to keep the fluid cool and a quite compressor(if there is such a thing). no dust to worry about, everything being submerged will mean everything is kept cool. yeah, that would be nice.
why do u want a fanless system :confused:

u can just watercool with 2 120mm silent fans in and u wont hear it

or spend $600 or somthing on that zalman case

saurongt

12-18-05, 10:53 AM

Fanless is nice....my pentium 1 system doesnt have any fans, except for the powersupply (the case fan i accidentally broke with a finger, so i took it out). It runs kinda warm, heatsink is hot to touch.

Assimilator87

12-22-05, 01:58 AM